UnNews talk:Tony Blair nearly sorry for Iraq mistakes

Discussion originally at User talk:Spike

Bit polemic for me Spike, but well within your skills territory. Kibitz if you feel inclined, or do you think it would be better to daft-it-up a bit?  EStop ⚓ 10:24, October 25, 2015 (UTC)

Yes, I kibitzed.

• At the start, all I thought was necessary was tightening up the wording. There were several very judgemental words that had to go, as anyone paying attention will be drawn to the same conclusions without you having to say it.
• Regarding Blair's use of the first person, and recalling our earlier discussion, I quoted The Queen ("one is impressed"). I also used John Major as a placeholder, because I don't know much about British politics; you can certainly find someone to utter this quote to whom it applies in ironic spades.
• Your take on the US side is just wrong. Iraq is not an issue anywhere in the US campaign. It is simply, yet another of Trump's kidney-punches at his fellow Republicans. He is the only one saying it (CNN will surely be repeating it), and he only said it to Jeb. But that is funny in itself. (Also the notion that Trump is a Republican, but that is for another day.) I hope my hypothetical Trump jab at Hillary comes through clearly enough.
• Holding Blair responsible for misinformation from subordinates and for consequences of his policy decisions, I view as generic political rhetoric, but that is fair game for an UnNews and I wouldn't change the focus (but did tone it down a bit). The US hand-wrung about Bush's inability to see inside the closed tyranny of Saddam's Iraq and against Rumsfeld for not anticipating the result of power vacuum; in favor of the current regime, which overtly doesn't know or care who's getting our secret arms shipments and where there are no consequences apart from winning the next election. Spıke 🎙️14:35 25-Oct-15

PS--As a matter of theory, I wouldn't have "dafted it up" at all. If you have engaged the reader in a study of the current wave of double-talk, artful wording will help, but a spoonful of goofy would just detract; perhaps a case of trying to be everything to everyone. If one comedy strategy works, it is very hard for two of them to be better. Spıke 🎙️14:38 25-Oct-15

Thank you Spike. Always concerned about advocacy (and lack of humor) when hitting this sort of thing, especially as I am not a huge fan of the chap. I read a column by Peter Hitchings that drew me to the piece, but he is known for breaking out the claws — especially when it comes to New Labour. I'll have a think about a Major replacement, perhaps Chukka Ummna, or even Teresa May is more appropriate, but Major is valid as he was unseated by Blair. My take on the U.S. side draws from the second source (and only a small bit of it), it is a few months old though. Thanks for fixing that and yes Trump comes through fine and is more relevant to the election campaign.

Holding Blair responsible for misinformation from subordinates and for consequences of his policy decisions is a generic line however, I believe (to use popular a New Labour coin), they took the concept to another level in the UK, and put it right in the public eye (or perhaps it was just a perception, as my job at the time meant becoming more politically aware). It is something the New Labour hierarchy were guilty of on many occasions beyond and during Iraq (you remember our kit discussion?). Tony Blair and Gordon Brown told half-truths during the Chilcott enquiry (by their own admission, as they were asked to return to the hearing and answer some questions for a second time: "Oh, you mean that Iraq War/Dossier."). Alistair Campbell's diaries (The Blair Years) is an interesting book, in so far as it is not particularly interesting beyond wars and Northern Ireland. I failed to get the impression of anything other than superficial, where policy making was concerned. The biggest focus was "telling the people" rather than "showing the people". Thanks for keeping that angle (I didn't really have any other!).  EStop ⚓ 15:44, October 25, 2015 (UTC)